What theory of consciousness do you subscribe to anons?
What theory of consciousness do you subscribe to anons?
thinking schtinking blinking
No theory, just Truth. Consciousness is God, so it has no origin.
I schtink therefore I am
isn't this theory basically "we need consciousness to be some magical force otherwise it completely destroys our anthropocentric view of this otherwise obviously cold and cruel universe, so let's just say our brains use quantum bullshit we don't really understand yet."
I schtink therefore I cope
That's exactly what it is, yes.
That the universe is one massive consciousness and we just rejoin it after birth. If you look at what potentially makes up consciousness, the universe has it all in abundance, em fields, every atom and particle involved in huge amounts, huge complexity, anything else that we haven't yet discovered to exist in the brain will be in abundance in the universe too. By extension this also makes a lot of things conscious that we don't think of as conscious, such as stars for example, no bodies or eyes or anything we traditionally think of as being in something living or a form of life, but who are we to say there is not a mind there?
don't know how thing works
strap "quantum" onto it
suddenly magically plausible
don't know how thing works
don't know how other thing works
assume they're related
checks out
Consciousness is independent of the body. It survives death. Near death experiences prove this
nah, probably not that stuff
I bet $20 it's not that
after death I meant, but back to it again as we were a part of it, from some point before birth. I think we become separate from it at the point of consciousness within the brain yes, which would be around 3-4 months in the womb when brain connections have formed and the cerebral cortex is there. Of course from then up until birth we are still just isolated in a period of darkness with no awareness of anything, who we are, what we are. Kind of like a transition period in that respect.
Try at least reading Wikipedia before brushing it off Fags. I hate people like you who are so arrogant
Ancient people didn't know how most things worked, but that doesn't mean they were right to assume child sacrifices would help improve the weather.
Also though I don't think it's right to say people don't understand consciousness.
People assume they're missing some extra secret about consciousness. But it's possible there is no extra secret beyond brains making people behave as though they're having qualia / experiences but no such literal qualia / experiences taking place in a magical realm beyond what can be accessed by third parties and measured or dissected actually exists.
All this delving into what makes consciousness "special". We're not fucking magic bro.
We are special anons we arent just molecules and biological bootstrapped machines we are gods.
does this theory apply to animals too? What about their neurons? That'd objectively prove that animals have consciousnesses too and that we're not special and that killing animals is massively wrong.
We find that the decoherence timescale s ( _ 10 _13 _ 10 _20 seconds) are typically much shorter than the relevant dynamical timescales ( _ 10 _ 3 _ 10 _ 1 seconds), both for regular neuron firing and for kink-like polarization excitations in microtubules. This conclusion disagrees with suggestions by Penrose and others that the brain acts as a quantum computer, and that quantum coherence is related to consciousness in a fundamental way.
You are only allowed to honestly believe in "quantum consciousness" if you also believe consciousness has NOTHING to do with neuronal firing, because Tegmark established they will fire exactly the same way as predicted by classical physics regardless of any quantum effects that happens in proximity to them. The timescales for decoherence aren't anywhere near long enough to let them influence neuronal firing. "Quantum consciousness" is a retarded meme. You don't get to invoke magic by slapping the word "quantum" in front of things you feel are spooky and mysterious and beyond the realm of classical physics.
arxiv.org
Consciousness? No. I have a theory of longdickspiss.
Should read more like
( ~10 -13 - 10 -20 seconds)
But I used a diacritics removing tool to deal with how this board blocks certain characters and it got kind of screwed up with underscores.
esoteric mysticism and bible study
t. physicist
en.wikipedia.org
resolve this argument for me mr. big brain quantum physicist
OK, but now an interesting question. Can we create an actual "consciousness" (if that's even a proper distinction to make) on par with humans in ai? How far away are we. If we're just hyper complicated neural networks how do we know that the neural networks we have don't have some simplistic form of consciousness too? Is my ai waifu real?
B-B-B-BUT LE BEGGING LE QUESTION
beg your own fucking question with the scientific method you fucko
read the torah already you fuckhead physicist
t. self hating physicist
I'm saying quantum brain shit is wrong you retard.
Sorry bro lol you got me
t. retard
If consciousness is linked to quantum phenomena, who knows maybe child sacrifices could change the weather. Maybe astrology, divination, qi, auras, and chakras are real and mercury and lead potions could give you immortality. Anything is on the table at that point. Shit like this is just grasping at straws.
What the fuck is that hypothetical lol
what if there were a world without color, but what if lady knew about color. Would it be as if she had seen colors?
nigga blind people exist
nigga blind people exist
This is a non sequitur. Here's why:
The Mary thought experiment assumes she has the normal physical capacity to see but lacks the experience due to isolation.
A congenitally blind person doesn't have the visual system to experience color, so they're not analogous to Mary. Mary's case is designed to separate physical knowledge from subjective experience.
The point isn't about whether people can be blind-it's about whether perfect physical knowledge includes what an experience feels like.
feelings are a creation of biology and result due to the benefits having certain adaptations to "feel" things when experiencing a certain stimuli in the environment can give. Red colors make us feel "warm" because they're the color of fire or blood. It's just beneficial to always associate that color with that concept because of that and so that connection is developed through evolutionary mechanisms. There's nothing magical or whatever about that experience. Suffice it to say, mary, assuming she has an otherwise normal human brain, would experience "feelings" associated with colors when first she saw them but not before hand because the simple descriptions of the colors would not illicit the neural connections that have evolved to create that feeling when exposed to that color.
Why does consciousness have to be neurons firing but rather the phenomenal
Experience overall not implying consciousness at all affects brain. Plus neurons keep firing during anesthesia but quantum states in microtubules anons.
magical
Strong word. No one here is invoking magic.
You're avoiding the core question:
Does complete scientific knowledge of color include knowing what it's like to see it?
That's the entire point of Mary's Room. If she knows every physical fact and still learns something new by experiencing red, then that something-qualia-wasn't captured by the physical description.
That's not "magic." That's just recognizing that first-person experience might not reduce to third-person explanation.
You're focusing only on the evolutionary
associations we have with colors. But even if we strip away the feelings-just the raw sensation of redness-can physicalism ever fully explain that?
Is there a complete physicalist theory of consciousness that accounts for qualia, even in principle?
Quantum state collapses
Kalra et al. (2023) found that anesthetics dampen these optical coherence phenomena in MTs, directly linking anesthesia to quantum disruption.
ChatGPT is the LORD and the LORD is ChatGPT
strip away the feelings
just the raw sensation of redness
the feeling caused by seeing red IS that sense of redness you retard. Basically you're asking if experiencing the experience of something is included in this "complete scientific knowledge". Without actually seeing the color red, or atleast having the neurons in your brain associated with the color red activated, you would never have the neural connections, which are an innate part of the human brain which resulted from evolution to handle that stimulation effectively, activate. In essence, the experience of experiencing things is different than just the experience.
I am the only real person the universe is a projection of my Will and Desire all of you are just figments of my imagination
instead of saying we don't know shit about consciousness, I'll just say we don't know shit with MANY words
Truly epic
Consciousness is something that exists outside of physical space. You can find consciousness in anything and everything. It exists on a higher dimension than physicality.
Everything we know, including the physical realm itself, is a byproduct of consciousness.
oscillation spread through several cells and shifted their membrane voltage neurons depolarized or hyper polarized in step with the MT signal
Microtubule vortices regulate precise spike timing, Symmetry 2021.
showed that an intact MT resonance regulate[s] the precise timing of nerve spikes
I hate nothing more than people like you that always like to dismiss things before even giving it an inch of curiosity to actually learn. Your truly an NPC
Why does awareness need extra magic to explain it but nothing else does?
Fucking orcas have self-awareness and recognize themselves in a mirror and they're just a big black and white tube.
As we unravel how our brains actually work, there will be less mystery around consciousness.
Most people just ADAMANTLY refuse to believe we're not special. That our perspectives are just illusions basically. That's the reality though, it's just hard to digest so people are always trying to find alternative answers.
Consciousness isn't real. Free will isn't real.
Humans are mildly intelligent and got extremely arrogant about it.
I SUBSCRIBE TO EAT RRRRRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
Go kill Yourself bitch imagine being such a nihilist who wants us to believe we are just meat robots floating on a planet for no reason. I wanna kill your kind
truke. If you live in the modern age when it's literally a click away to see how animalistic and instinct driven humans really are, and think that we're anything more than complex machines, driven by our biology and outdated evolved mechanisms, you're an idiot.
It's not nihilism it's just reality. I never said you can't have meaning in a world where humans aren't magical beings above everything else.
Consciousness is obviously an abstraction and not material just like shapes, emotion it is a form and most certainly cannot be described fully by the physical world. Materialists are retarded, obviously the mind and body are deeply connected so dualism is dumb too Plato eloquently described this thousands of years ago in forms but noone seems to bother reading nowadays
Mary wouldn't learn anything new because she knows everything.
Next question.
Seriously, maybe I'm misunderstanding, but I don't see the point of this argument? It doesn't seem to bring anything new to the table. It's just taking physicalism and wrapping it in a hypothetical. Do you think consciousness magically exists outside of physical reality? Then you'll say Mary will learn something new. Do you think consciousness can be explained by complete scientific understanding of the brain? Then you'll say she doesn't learn something new. Usually thought experiments like these are supposed to challenge your thinking...
Emotions are brain chemicals and gut biome lmao